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Modeller, Scratch Builder, Assembler...........What Are You?

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  • Modeller, Scratch Builder, Assembler...........What Are You?

    I don't wish to highjack Hardrock's wonderful Zulu build log so have migrated the discussion to a new thread.

    Someone has opened an intersting point here, one I've had a lot of discussions (arguments) with buddies with over the years.

    To take my recent Skipjack build, outer hull, tower, rudders, dive planes all supplied by kit maker or after market supplier. WTC self designed and scratchbuilt, with off the shelf electronic components...............so a mish mash of kit/scratch/modified. Am I an assembler, scratchbuilder, modifier, butcher, some hybrid of all of these. On the surface it's an assembled kit, under the skin it's a scratch/modified thingy!

    In the case of Hardrock's Zulu build, on the surface it's completely a scratch build (amazing stuff), under the skin it's a modified kit supplied WTC, so what is it in totality!

    My own description for myself would be a Scratch-Asser.................the other way arounnd is even worse!!!!!!!!!!

    The Boattrainman
    Last edited by The Boattrainman; 09-05-2017, 12:46 PM.
    ''We're after men, and I wish to God I was with them........!''

  • #2
    Notwithstanding the bad jokes, I'm not convinced that there's such thing a thing as a 'Scratch Builder' (that's not to denigrate the work of those great model makers who call themselves such).

    All one can really say is 'I scratch built this component or that part, but even the finest exhibition models contain some off the shelf componenets.

    The Boattrainman
    Last edited by The Boattrainman; 09-05-2017, 12:46 PM.
    ''We're after men, and I wish to God I was with them........!''

    Comment


    • #3
      Seen plenty of fine models that are built 100% from raw materials.

      If you use commercial fittings to complete a model then you can say it's part scratchbuilt and list the items purchased versus built.

      However splitting hairs over semantics is becoming a bit pointless, as the younger generations aren't coming through with the skill set to build very much at all.

      It's what becomes of an economic system based on clean fingernail, white collar employment and get some dude in China or a robot to make it.
      DIVE IN! Go on, go on, go on, go on, GO ON! http://www.diveintomodelsubmarines.co.uk

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Subculture View Post
        Seen plenty of fine models that are built 100% from raw materials.

        If you use commercial fittings to complete a model then you can say it's part scratchbuilt and list the items purchased versus built.

        However splitting hairs over semantics is becoming a bit pointless, as the younger generations aren't coming through with the skill set to build very much at all.

        It's what becomes of an economic system based on clean fingernail, white collar employment and get some dude in China or a robot to make it.
        ..... and with a resounding THUD, Andy puts a point on it all.

        We're the last of the breed, guys.

        David
        "... well, that takes care of Jorgenson's theory!"

        Comment


        • #5
          I am definately an arse scratcher - just ask my wife. Speaking of whom; I just received a father's day gift from She Who Must Be Obeyed (via our daughter who lives in Paris) - A big chunk of French renshape. Hurrah. Views?

          Click image for larger version

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          I knocked this out in about two hours. What a great material.

          Comment


          • #6
            It's easy to be pessimistic, but there's no doubt the physical/manual skillset among young people is diminishing.

            I work in youth music so meet plenty of young kids and it's incredible how little they can fix or repair (even the most basic issue with their own musical instruments).

            When I was in my teens, we toured with a large orchestra, and the manager arrived one day with a pile of wood, tools and screws and asked us to help knock up a load of transport boxes for the equipment, it was automatically assumed we could do it (and we did).

            I got into model making as a kid out of sheer boredom, the rise of computer gaming/internet/I-phone and some parents need to fill every damn minute of their child's free time are just some of the reasons I suppose.

            It's not that young people don't have skills, they're just in a different direction now, there's a bigger emphasis on preparing kids to be 'economic' units and not individuals with a unique set of competencies. If you look at the huge downturn in golf club memberships (here anyway), people don't seem to want to partake in any physical stuff that involves a long-term commitment of time or effort. Look at the rise of 'box set' or 'long form' multi episode TV, a massive commitment of passive time watching a screen is required. The concept that someone would put 100-200 hours into making something/anything is anathema to most people.

            Yet, the current average European kid spends 2 - 2.5 hours per day on their I-phone. That's around 900 hours a year, would build many fine models in that time.............!

            Funny enough, I'm happy to be such a rarity, I know it's not great news for the modelling industry itself.

            With Andy's point above I now know what I'll call myself from now on.................lucky.

            Happy building.

            Rob
            ''We're after men, and I wish to God I was with them........!''

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by The Boattrainman View Post
              It's easy to be pessimistic, but there's no doubt the physical/manual skillset among young people is diminishing.

              I work in youth music so meet plenty of young kids and it's incredible how little they can fix or repair (even the most basic issue with their own musical instruments).

              When I was in my teens, we toured with a large orchestra, and the manager arrived one day with a pile of wood, tools and screws and asked us to help knock up a load of transport boxes for the equipment, it was automatically assumed we could do it (and we did).

              I got into model making as a kid out of sheer boredom, the rise of computer gaming/internet/I-phone and some parents need to fill every damn minute of their child's free time are just some of the reasons I suppose.

              It's not that young people don't have skills, they're just in a different direction now, there's a bigger emphasis on preparing kids to be 'economic' units and not individuals with a unique set of competencies. If you look at the huge downturn in golf club memberships (here anyway), people don't seem to want to partake in any physical stuff that involves a long-term commitment of time or effort. Look at the rise of 'box set' or 'long form' multi episode TV, a massive commitment of passive time watching a screen is required. The concept that someone would put 100-200 hours into making something/anything is anathema to most people.

              Yet, the current average European kid spends 2 - 2.5 hours per day on their I-phone. That's around 900 hours a year, would build many fine models in that time.............!

              Funny enough, I'm happy to be such a rarity, I know it's not great news for the modelling industry itself.

              With Andy's point above I now know what I'll call myself from now on.................lucky.

              Happy building.

              Rob
              Good stuff, Robb. The fair (and I think accurate) assessment of where our younger people are today as to their acquired and assumed skills. Seems that all these kids are good at is thumb-directed activities; and those activities of a virtual, not real, nature.

              Take away electricity and the human die-off will be near total.

              Today's know-nothing, entitled, little Cherubs don't even know how to rub two sticks together to make fire. A cell-phone they know how to charge -- everything else ... nothing. What ever happened to shop-class, drafting-class, and the other school activities that taught use of hands, and acquainted one with the power, utility, and precision of hand and machine tools?

              Our kids are marching, head first, into the maw of Skynet.

              David
              Last edited by He Who Shall Not Be Named; 09-06-2017, 11:39 AM.
              "... well, that takes care of Jorgenson's theory!"

              Comment


              • #8
                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hER0Qp6QJNU

                Comment


                • #9
                  It's nurture rather than nature. The education system is geared towards equipping students with a skill set for future employment. In Western society, skilled manufacturing has largely been replaced by automation or it's been moved overseas to exploit a cheap labour force. So emphasis has shifted towards design, or marketing of products.

                  Some practical jobs do still exist in industry, but it's much smaller than it used to be, and often a lot of those industries are relying on immigrant labour to back up a skills shortage. Where I live in London, there used to be Technical Colleges dotted all round the capital. They're pretty much all gone now, replaced by colleges of further education. So where schools once taught craft schools, that time is now used for computer programming skills. Where you once learnt how to work wood and metal, you now build a webpage or write an app.

                  There we are, changing times.
                  DIVE IN! Go on, go on, go on, go on, GO ON! http://www.diveintomodelsubmarines.co.uk

                  Comment


                  • #10


                    Superb lecture, excellent summary.

                    Also having some experience with addiction services, I'm seeing some of the symptoms of addiction from smart phone users, the Dopamine rush, inability to part with the phone, constant checking and re-checking, the approval 'high' (yippee, someone likes me), lost hours, guilt over neglected work/family etc. etc. With four decades of youth work behind me I've decided i-phones should be for adults only (i.e, over eighteens).

                    I get a lot of grief from my daughter about the fact that even though my job would glady give me an i-phone (free!!), I have stubbornly kept my Samsung field phone for use as a phone and only a phone, I can get anything else required from the web at home on the laptop or in work on the desktop. I've done two lectures on this for work projects already!

                    The best recent example is where Ed Sheeran demanded that the fans at his concert stop filming him and put down their phones and enjoy the concert in the moment, hilarious.

                    I genuinely think we won't be thanking Mark Zuckerburg and Co. in a few years, even if we are a bit away from Skynet just yet (hopefully).

                    This is not 'old fart' talk, I'm tech literate, media savvy, socially adept and reasonably sane.

                    Now back to actually making something!!!

                    Rob

                    ''We're after men, and I wish to God I was with them........!''

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Oh, man! Just finished this guys presentation. An excellent speaker. A must see-hear for anyone wanting a rational explanation of how our snowflakes got that way and what they have in store for them once the phone is put down. Thank you so much for that link, Andreas!

                      The only things I quibble with Mr. Senik about is his assertion that the Millennial's are not at fault for their disjointed expectations of life; and his belief that's it's up to Corporations to accommodate and foster these idiots once they enter the work place (real world).

                      Very good stuff, and I recommend a careful review of this YouTube video. Again: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lU3R0ot18bg&t=13

                      An eye-opener!

                      David
                      "... well, that takes care of Jorgenson's theory!"

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Working in a corporate environment I can aussure you that big companies really care about nobody. It's just a question if you have the mental tools to deal with it or not.....

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by He Who Shall Not Be Named View Post

                          Oh, man! Just finished this guys presentation. An excellent speaker. A must see-hear for anyone wanting a rational explanation of how our snowflakes got that way and what they have in store for them once the phone is put down. Thank you so much for that link, Andreas!

                          The only things I quibble with Mr. Senik about is his assertion that the Millennial's are not at fault for their disjointed expectations of life; and his belief that's it's up to Corporations to accommodate and foster these idiots once they enter the work place (real world).

                          Very good stuff, and I recommend a careful review of this YouTube video. Again: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lU3R0ot18bg&t=13

                          An eye-opener!

                          David
                          Ha, ha, me too, and I work in the semiconductor busyness........oldskool Nokia.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by DrSchmidt View Post
                            Working in a corporate environment I can aussure you that big companies really care about nobody. It's just a question if you have the mental tools to deal with it or not.....
                            And that's the way it should be. It's not your Bosses job to make you feel good. That's your job! The only thing the Boss should provide is a clear directive as to what you are to do, and a pay-check for the work you perform for him. Any other relationship between you and the work-place is fluff and nonsense.

                            David
                            "... well, that takes care of Jorgenson's theory!"

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I tend to disagree. Of course one is payed for performance, but your employer also hast to take care, that he provides an environment in which you are not becoming mentally ill, e.g. by more and more work in increasingly less time and with continously shrinking budgets. We are humans and we should work in a humane environment.

                              Comment

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